Skill Database - Development Thread

[David]

I've started to work on skill tables, such as the ones seen here. As of now, only the first one is full; click the "+" to view all the descriptive information. They're eventually going to be added to every related informational page (e.g. the racial tables inserted into the race pages), so before I get too far ahead of myself I'm enlisting your help in a few things.

[*]Check the accuracy of the information as it's added. [*]Check to make sure the functionality is working. [*]Suggest improvements.

Known bugs:

[*][ Fixed ] Table columns aren't the same width, which leads to... [*][ Fixed ] Text in tables not word wrapping correctly. [*][ Fixed ] Table Toggle: it requires two clicks to open a second table consecutively. [*][ Fixed ] Table Toggle: no animation. [*][ Fixed ] Table Toggle: toggle individual cells, and then toggle the entire table - the table cell button markers don't show the correct status until after you hit the table button again. [*]Minimizing sections has animation lag/jumps due to margins on the CSS class.

Completed Pathways:

[*]Racial [*]Armor [*]Dragon Knight [*]Nightblade

There are a few other new things that will hopefully roll out soon-ish, but I suppose I can bump this thread when we get to that point.

 

Oh, and if anyone knows basic HTML and isn't bothered by mind-numbing data entry... You can help with the tables if you so wish.

[Musclemagic]

Effing amazing start!

[Francis]

Great work, man.

 

3. Suggest improvements.

 

We could use an "expand all" button.

[David]

We could use an "expand all" button.

 

That (and Musclemagic's minimized section suggestion) are good suggestions that could be implemented. I guess the important question I should be asking is this -- how will this be used? That will impact how the information is displayed by default.

 

For example, those of you constantly coming up with builds -- do you always have that skill document open comparing skills side by side? If not, what is the most useful implementation of this information?

 

Alternatively, it may end up just as something people check out haphazardly once (if that) to see a few descriptions that confused them. Who knows.

[Musclemagic]

Hmm.. here's how I'd set it up: (Everything's minimizable)

 

RACIAL Trees

Aldmeri trees

 

Daggerfall trees

 

Ebonheart trees

 

CLASS Trees

DK trees

 

NB trees

 

Sorc trees

 

Temp trees

 

ITEM Trees

2H  + DW + S&S trees

 

Destro + Resto + Bow trees

 

Armor trees

 

OTHER Trees

PvP trees

 

Disease trees

 

Guild trees

 

Soul Magic + Undaunted trees

 

 

Start with THESE minimized, and then let people maximize into each part or THESE into a more specific tree from there.

 

That would be the easiest way for me anyway.

 

Maybe make a "skill selector" where there's a button on each active ability that allows you to add it to bar 1 or bar 2... and then have a Bar 1 and Bar 2 somewhere on the side... That would be super cool, but probably a lot of scripting.. XD

 

 

EDIT: Actually, it's perfect how it is.. just make everything minimizable and possibly do the Add to Bar 1 or Add to Bar 2 thing in the future. XD

[David]

Maybe make a "skill selector" where there's a button on each active ability that allows you to add it to bar 1 or bar 2... and then have a Bar 1 and Bar 2 somewhere on the side... That would be super cool, but probably a lot of scripting.. XD

 

That's almost certainly beyond my poverty-level ability with JavaScript, but do you have an example of anything that comes close to what you're envisioning? It would be cool to work on some sort of character builder far off in the future.

 

Also, I like your categories as they're much more even between the sections. Hopefully I'll have the shells of the skills completely done in the next few days; then it will be easier to see where things fit nicely.

 

It wouldn't be too hard to have all of the sections minimized by default, with a corner option to expand one-by-one. I could also have a static bar to "Collapse / Expand All" that follows the screen as you scroll. Then again that's the type of thing that has conflicts with existing features, like that annoying black fade-out bar at the top of every page.

[Musclemagic]

That's almost certainly beyond my poverty-level ability with JavaScript, but do you have an example of anything that comes close to what you're envisioning? It would be cool to work on some sort of character builder far off in the future.

 

Also, I like your categories as they're much more even between the sections. Hopefully I'll have the shells of the skills completely done in the next few days; then it will be easier to see where things fit nicely.

 

It wouldn't be too hard to have all of the sections minimized by default, with a corner option to expand one-by-one. I could also have a static bar to "Collapse / Expand All" that follows the screen as you scroll. Then again that's the type of thing that has conflicts with existing features, like that annoying black fade-out bar at the top of every page.

 

Yeah, I figured that it would be too much to get a bar builder.........

 

.... .....       .........

 

.... I HATE THAT BLACK FADE-OUT BAR WITH A PASSION!!! Haha!

[David]

(Everything's minimizable)

 

Alright, I think I've implemented what you had in mind. You can check and let me know -- toggle buttons are in the right corner of section titles. The only caveat is that it's all unminimized by default at the moment, since at this stage in development I want to see changes easily.

[Francis]

So, no "expand/collapse all descriptions" button per section? It sounds like a good idea to me. But it's up to you, I guess.

 

The builder sounds like it could be a gamble to attract some site traffic. But it won't really matter to me since I already put mine down on paper.

[David]

So, no "expand/collapse all descriptions" button per section? It sounds like a good idea to me. But it's up to you, I guess.

 

The builder sounds like it could be a gamble to attract some site traffic. But it won't really matter to me since I already put mine down on paper.

 

I had a (mostly) working expand / collapse all last night, I'm just trying to think of a way to implement it well without restructuring everything.

[Francis]

I had a (mostly) working expand / collapse all last night, I'm just trying to think of a way to implement it well without restructuring everything.

 

Oh, okay. Good luck with that.

[David]

Oh, okay. Good luck with that.

 

Should be finished now. The button is in the top-left cell of every table.

 

The only bug that I found happens if you toggle individual cells, and then toggle the entire table - the table cell button markers don't show the correct status until after you hit the table button again.

 

EDIT: And it requires two clicks to open a second table consecutively. Damn it.

[Francis]

560 armor is about how much armor full Light armor will give you. With 560 armor + Light I think it'll be about = to heavy. This is just speculation.

 

Any reason for going Light instead of Heavy Armor + Bound Armor? With Dark Exchange, regen doesn't matter much, so you'll have 21% more effective MP due to spells being 21% cheaper..but compared to what? As a tank you'll need to measure how often you can keep up your mitigation abilities compared to keeping them up with light armor on and see which one grants you the most mitigation..so it's not really just about how much mitigation the armor itself gives.

 

Crap, sounds like mage tanks would really be a threat to me.

 

Should be finished now. The button is in the top-left cell of every table.

 

The only bug that I found happens if you toggle individual cells, and then toggle the entire table - the table cell button markers don't show the correct status until after you hit the table button again.

 

EDIT: And it requires two clicks to open a second table consecutively. Damn it.

 

Break a leg with that.

[David]

This thread is for troubleshooting / developing the skill database; please just make a new thread for all specific skill questions / builds / etc.

 

I've cleared out this thread (which was most of it) and moved the skill questions here.

[Francis]

It's the fuzz, man. Run!

(Get it? Cause he's a Llama.)

[David]

... I HATE THAT BLACK FADE-OUT BAR WITH A PASSION!!! Haha!

 

Really? I couldn't live without it for navigation, especially the new content / active topics link. It does get in the way occasionally.

 

As for the bugs, does anyone feel it's unusable or too unpolished as of now? May just call it a day and go back to inputting the skill effects and what-not.

[Xenon]

This thread is for troubleshooting / developing the skill database; please just make a new thread for all specific skill questions / builds / etc.

 

I've cleared out this thread (which was most of it) and moved the skill questions here.

You miss quite a lot of abilities in the list. 

I posted a HUGE list of leaked abilities (in the first spoiler).

 

it was primary intended for the skill database......

 

sad panda

[Francis]

Really? I couldn't live without it for navigation, especially the new content / active topics link. It does get in the way occasionally.

 

As for the bugs, does anyone feel it's unusable or too unpolished as of now? May just call it a day and go back to inputting the skill effects and what-not.

 

Input the skill effects and whatnot. I've been using the older skill table since this one's incomplete. Plus I'm not seeing any bugs, so you're good.

 

 

You miss quite a lot of abilities in the list. 

I posted a HUGE list of leaked abilities (in the first spoiler).

 

it was primary intended for the skill database......

 

sad panda

 

I'm sure he already has a list. But, still, I'm sure he had to move your post because everybody else's wouldn't make sense without yours on the new thread.

[Xenon]

Fair enough.

i'll edit away the list in that other thread (most people will just get confused by the wall of text anyway).

Better to have the information in one place (the database).

 

 

I'll check back at a later time to see if the database still miss vital information...

(for example; i got all nightblade active skills and the database have non or very few nightblade active skills right now)

[David]

You miss quite a lot of abilities in the list. 

I posted a HUGE list of leaked abilities (in the first spoiler).

 

it was primary intended for the skill database......

 

sad panda

 

I just moved your post so the other thread had some context to make sense, but I was aware of it. I still have to input all of the descriptions / effects / costs / etc for most of the skills -- I know there's quite a lot missing right now.

 

Update

Fixed the following bugs...

[*][ Fixed ] Table Toggle: it requires two clicks to open a second table consecutively.

[*][ Fixed ] Table Toggle: no animation.

[*][ Fixed ] Table Toggle: toggle individual cells, and then toggle the entire table - the table cell button markers don't show the correct status until after you hit the table button again.

The remaining "bug" (might just be a general jquery issue) is exceptionally minor and has no usability implications at all.

 

Started inputting data for the Nightblade. Now that the script is basically done the data will go in much faster.

[Francis]

Oh, yeah. You might wanna clarify that the Dragonknight Standard ability actually throws a standard forward that deals damage, and does not center around the caster.

[David]

Oh, yeah. You might wanna clarify that the Dragonknight Standard ability actually throws a standard forward that deals damage, and does not center around the caster.

 

Are you sure it's thrown? I thought it was planted.

 

That also raises the question of whether I should just be listing the effects of the skills (in a standardized format), or if it's more helpful (as stats will likely change) to have nothing but descriptions like Tamriel Foundry. I've been doing almost solely effects and pruning the more descriptive elements, such as "create a path of shadow" or "throw a standard."

[Xenon]

It would be very helpful to have stats at level 1 and how good they scale per level up (and maybe stats at max). But that would be a *nightmare* to keep *updated* as stats are likely to change in every single beta build. You basically need a way to extract the data from the client in an automated way.

 

I might be able to extract such information in the future, but not until the game actually release so i can start probing what information we can and can not pull directly from the servers....

 

Information you should enter in the database is probably only stuff that is not likely to change very soon - like Range (and area), Cast time and resource used (stamina or magicka, but not resource cost). And after that you should probably just type down a general description that explains what the ability does (Poison DD + short duration Poison DoT with a Snare).

 

 

Having said that. It I would personally be very interested if you have a spreadsheet or just random level 1 stats in a notepad. If you do then I would love to get a copy (even if the information is already out-dated). I already got stats (such as cast time, range, area, resource being used, resource cost, damage, duration etc) on most abilities by watching several hours of leaked in-game photo, freezing the picture and manually typing it down... but i still miss some.

 

I am also interested in trying to figure out how well abilities scale towards max level. I only have a few skills shown at higher character level than 3 and higher skill level than 1.... and what the different morph options are for each skill. Only got a handful of them so far. This is secondary as how much they scale will probably frequently be changed during the later beta stages.

[Francis]

Thrown or planted...I'm not sure. But the initial impression I got from all the Elder Souls tables was that the dragon knight emanated flames from his person. I think it's gotta be thrown, otherwise we wouldn't have two separate range and radius values.

[Xenon]

Yes. It use the same notation as targeted AoE use (so it is probably not a PBAoE or an aura that follow the dragon knight around), but rather a standard that you can throw up to 15m and have a 12 second duration AoE of 8 meter radius from the point of impact.

 

 

 

This is the in-game description of the ability:

 

Darknight Standard I

Instant

15 m. range / 8 m. radius

200 Ultimate

For 12 seconds, while on Dragonknight

Standard I

* Enemies take 6 Fire damage every second

* Enemies receive 50% less healing

* An ally may activate the Shackle ability,

damaging and rooting enemies in the area

Unlocked at Ardent Flame Rank 12

 

 

(I see nothing wrong from the description in the database on this ability.... except maybe that the Shackle Synergy effect: "...deal damage and root enemies *in the [8m radius] area*")