Thal

I always heard something that sounded more like "day" than "death" but glad to know what it actually is meant to be.

Hmmm, hadn't thought of that particular combination until you mentioned it, but I really like that idea and it could work really well. I also wanted to throw something random out here that effects everyone's build regardless of class, and that is the way regeneration values are calculated by the game in regard to stamina/magicka/health regen: My question is: at what point in a calculation of regen do % increases get factored in? The timing of this could have significant outcomes on calculations of regen and whether or not you have enough regen to cater for particular move combinations. I think it is best illustrated by the following example: E.g. Redguard Templar, with Restoring Aura. Equipment: Medium Armour full set; 3 pieces of his armour have a +10 stamina regen enchantment Total stamina: 1600 Method 1 Calculation of stamina regen: 1600 x 3/100 = 48 stamina/second base rate If you then apply the + 28% regen for 7 pieces of medium armour and +15% for Restoring Order you then get: 48 + 48 x 0.43 = 68.64 stamina/second Then apply other raw bonuses: redguard passive and 3 enchantments of stamina regen; 64.64 + 7 + (10 x 3) = 105.64 stamina/second Therefore by this calculation your Total Stamina Regeneration would be 105.64 stamina/second Method 2 Calculation of stamina regen: 1600 x 3/100 = 48 stamina/second base rate Now adding gear enchantments and racial passive raw increases first: 48 + 7 + (10 x 3) = 85 stamina/second Then applying % increases from armour passives (28%) and active abilities (15%): 85 + 85 x 0.43 = 121.55 stamina/second Therefore by this calculation your Total Stamina Regeneration would be 121.55 stamina/second Conclusion As you can see in this example the regeneration rate difference is equivalent to: about 16 stamina/second So depending on what order % increases and raw increases are applied, there can be phenomenal changes to your stamina/magicka/health regeneration rates and what you calculate your rate to be in order to work out how often you can use the Active skills you choose to slot. While 16 in this example doesn't seem like a terribly huge difference - it works out to really be quite large and can make the difference between picking one Active skill over another due to cost-effective calculations. So the question is: do we know in which order it is calculated? What has everyone been assuming the calculation order to be? And if you get a chance to jump in beta next time - see if you can work out the order if we don't already know. *Note: the build I gave was merely an example and I do not intend to actually use a medium armour templar. ** Additional Note: I have no idea what order the calculation is made so I have been factoring the potential for it to go either way when looking at my potential builds. And one last question - is there any limitations like there is in Skyrim when it comes to using the same enchantment on every piece of armour. E,g. Could you have a stamina regen enchantment on every piece of your Heavy Armour?

Dodge is both active and passive in the sense that you can actively dodge to reliably avoid an attack and thereby consume some stamina to execute the dodge, but there is also the passive 'dodge chance' which is a chance on every hit to avoid the attack and, I believe, only is gained through the use of skills, notably the Medium armour Active "Evasion" which gives 30% dodge chance for 20 seconds for about 560 stamina cost at lvl 50 (estimated since costs 60 stamina at lvl 1). And yeah Shadow Cloak could be quite useless against a decent player because as Irons mentioned you could just hold block and turn around a lot, and yes you can just hit dodge, but also if you have "immovable" slotted then you could use it and their 2.5 seconds of invisibility will wear off long before your 8 seconds of CC immunity and increased mitigation.In fact, in a spar/duel against a NB, if you can manage to keep up Immovable the whole time then you pretty much make life hell for the NB and really ruin his/her chances of winning the 1 vs 1 since most NBs will rely fairly heavily on being able to stun/disorient their opponent...By the way, anyone know what "disorient" actually does compared with a normal stun? I've seen it listed as a "disabling effect" so I assume it must be like a daze in other games but was wondering if anyone knew for certain? Can they still do anything while disorientated? I mostly ask because it is also hard to compare Shield Charge to Bash because I don't know if disorient is as good as I think it could be...

Yeah fair enough, I misunderstood what you meant and thought you meant it was not to great a skill in general.

I think Ash Cloud could prove more significant in a PvP fight than you think depending on your build or if it is used to support another player. I compare it to the use of static AoE slows in other MMOs, like Sticky Tar for LoreMasters in LOTRO, where you have a player deploy the aoe slow and the player then procedes to kite the enemy back and forth through the cloud/tar/aoe. If you cross back and forth through the AoE you strongly reduce the amount of incoming damage received through the melee classes not being able to catch up and hit you. I always have to remember that time is damage and lack of time hitting is a direct reduction to incoming dps which gives more opportunity to dish out 'un-answered' dps to the opponent, give HoT more pulses without sustaining damage, etc. I've seen similar things done with great success in other MMOs and such a skill being called essential for any class that has one. Here there is more potential because not only is the slow huge (70% is ridiculous in my opinion) but a miss chance plays even more into the advantages of crossing back through and through the cloud. However, in saying that, I also have to admit the effectiveness will be dependent on the unstated radius of the skill. Anything less than 5m radius may be ineffective due to the speed of dodges and anyone can sprint as well and short distances would not drain stamina much. 14.4 seconds is not the largest duration but I believe it to be still long enough to make good use of (assuming you have the passive of course). Fiery reach compared to Shield Charge, however, I side with you in that I too would preference Shield Charge for both the stun and the fact it uses stamina but also because it's a cheaper skill too. Haha yeah, I always imagine a horde of attackers busting through the front gate of a major castle and their first wave spilling into the courtyard only to all be leveled by a huge AoE, and as the dust settles, the second wave approach to see the Emperor and his honour guard (i.e. his guild) arrayed in front of them with the Emperor charging up his/her second AoE after giving a huge buff to the players around him/her. And yeah, I agree in that it will eventually and ultimately depend on the design of the availability, spawning, construction and uses they allow for the siege equipment but it does have room to make the game better as well as less enjoyable. Just tell the noobs to fire the siege weapons or tell them there is some secret achievement linked to it so that they do the job instead of you and you can stay at the head of the fight on foot.

Yeah I've definitely been guilty of multiple consecutive replies... Will curb my ways.

I can understand where you're coming from on this one, but how would we lay siege to a castle or keep without them? I mean I would hate to have to sit in front of a gate with 20 other people and slowly chop away at it until it finally broke. Walls would be ridiculous. You would need some mighty magical explosions to take out walls and then there would be the cost of these spells and the OP nature of them if used on other players (most likely be one-shot spells).I could see them getting rid of ballistas, catapults and trebuchets if they instead gave us ladders and/or siege towers to place against the walls and thereby have some method of scaling them. I cannot see a battering ram taking away from PvP fights and the reliance on strong builds to win fights. After all, I don't think the battering rams will have an affect in opponents.Catapults and ballistas may do large amounts of damage to enemy players for what seems like little skill to use but remember they are slow and provide much needed AoE damage to stationary enemy formations and are probably a necessary counter to preventing large amounts of stacking and combat solely happening in front of gates. Plus it gives the noobs something to use while the better players head in on foot.I do see problems such as when ballistas and catapults focus fire the tops of gateways and make it near impossible to fire arrows and spells from the top of the wall but in some ways this expands the type of combat seen in sieges because it necessitates the defenders to employ troops to rush the siege engines from behind, build opposing siege equipment, make sallies out of the gate for quick counters to break what siege weapons they can, use squads of NBs to neutralise poorly defended siege equipment, etc. Plus not having something to cover your advance as the attackers can be a touch too irritating. After all, when a defender on the wall starts taking a beating at range, he/she can slip behind the wall and regen. Cannot say the same about the attackers. And at the very least, there becomes a spot for support-style players who can cast "Siege Shield" for groups.In summary, I don't think they will be exploited as high-damage hits on defenceless trapped opponents or even have a great enough speed of projectile or rate of fire to do so, but rather will make it a little more tactical and allow a little more excitement with the wall breaks and explosions that ensue in their wake. But then again, that is fine so long as they are balanced of course. And there will be nothing more satisfying than raiding the back lines of an enemy force just as they are setting up their siege equipment and thereby wasting the resources they just spent to acquire them. Though of course, back to balancing, hopefully they aren't a spammable cheap resource but rather take some effort or expense to acquire because you will be correct in saying they detract from gameplay if they are too cheap and readily available.And if you're getting hit too much by them while engaging the enemy on foot and it's ruining your normal pvp - then as the Spartans say: "Fight in the shade". There will always be spots they can't hit you under. ;)P.S. I agree about the soul gems/shards issue. It has great potential just to get annoying casting soul trap constantly while leveling...

Does Fiery Reach still pull a foe forward who is using Immovable at the time you use Fiery Reach? I would think that it would since the pull, I assume, would not technically count as a "disabling effect" right?---------- I have a feeling Marked Target, though expensive to cast, will at times be crucial for bringing some foes down. If you have a DK in Heavy armour popping off Spiked Armour every 17s and Immovable every 8 who also happens to have decent in-combat Health regen - you're going to have real problems dps'ing through the mitigation. In fact, I would doubt any NB's burst dps would ever get such a DK close enough to "low health" for them to even use Assasin's Blade and take advantage of the DW passive. In a case like that, without Marked Target, I would think that a NB would just be forced to ignore the DK and stay stealthed or die every time...----------On the topic of stamina/magicka regeneration: I agree with what everyone has been saying in regard to the biggest limitation to actives is simply the stamina/magicka consumption vs. regeneration. In light of that, does anyone know how much blocking consumes? It's hard to figure out how much stamina to leave when working on actives and trying to consider stamina used on dodges, blocking, bracing, sprinting etc. And I have a feeling that if you don't allow some room in your stamina regen to factor in these things and instead consume all your stamina through the use of actives then your character may be at severe disadvantage without having the resources for at least one of the activities I listed.If someone at lvl 50 has a shield, the shield + one-hand passives, maybe even an enchant to reduce cost of blocking - how much roughly would they be depleting their stamina for every block?

Hahaha, yeah that reminds me of what I used to do sometimes in Battlefield 3, I'd yell "For Frodo!" into my mic for the whole team to hear just as we started the match. It used to drive some people nuts. :PWhen I played Lord of the Rings Online, I had this great raid leader in PvP who used to boot people if they failed to follow the raid assist's target. He'd only give them one chance. We used to use emblems above people's characters in the raid to make it easier for people to follow them across the map as well. He would usually have a sun symbol above his head and I cannot ever play that game without remembering "Follow the fking sun!" whenever I step out into the PvP zone...

And I'm really thankful that it's not true. Would be so so annoying to have to live with always needing to slot 2 weapon skills when you only have 5 in total anyway.

There's a lot of options I know, but hey, there's a lot of things people tend to say.

I was fairly sure health, magicka and stamina at lvl 1 were all at 100 of each unless you had a racial passive modifying that. Could be wrong though.

Soaks, I believe (like in Skyrim) you will have a level for each skill line that is independent of your actual character level. So you could be lvl 50 but only have your Draconic Skill line at level 23. So using abilities from a skill line gives you experience toward lvling that skill line up and I believe that all actives and passives in every skill line have different "levels" required in that skill line for you to be able to purchase them using your skill points. IE.g. Inhale may be lvl 36 in Draconic Skill line to purchase it using a skill point (not sure what lvl it actually is though). Hence the racial passives that give extra experience percentages toward certain skill lines, for example Redguards get +15% experience on top of normal experience for using skills in the "Weapon and Shield" skill line.

Thanks Raar for those examples of Set Bonuses and thanks Irons for the confirmation that the health stat was indeed in the 1800s.I agree that balancing b between adding total stat vs. adding just regen of the stat is going to be fairly important in determining how you can spam and time your skills as well as longevity of effectiveness of your build.In some ways I think the way someone handles the three stats in amount and regen combined with analysing the passives and actives for cost-effectiveness is going to be the most crucial aspect potentially of both PvE and PvP.

Cheers Raar for that information especially the list of types of enchantments! I was quite interested to know about the existence of combat stamina/health/magicka regeneration as I've been wondering if that was possible for a while now. Seems if flat 10 is the amount for that then it might be a better option than enchantments that simply add more of a stat, at least more useful the build/s I intend to have. Yeah I guess the block one I saw must have been one enchantment with two effects on blocking rather than two separate enchantments. Thanks for the clarity and info!It will definitely be interesting to see what kind of set bonuses are revealed in the future...Another random thing - with the pvp leaked video with Japanese commentary - did anyone properly see what the max health was on that guy? I could see he had gear with health on it and had spent 39 level points into health but I couldn't figure out whether it was in the 1200's or 1800's due to poor resolution? Well, at least that was my guess at what the first digit for his max health was. If it was 1800's then regen of the stat you put more points into is going to be fairly significant.

Ah okay, thanks for filling me in on the enchants, that's good to know.I think he is getting Rapid Maneuvre from the PvP skill line. Costs 840 stamina; +20% Aoe run speed boost for 20s; Immune to snares and roots; breaks when attack is made.Too expensive in regard to stamina in my opinion. Would rather use stamina on 2 uses of Immovable for the same cost. After all immunity drops moment you attack anyway... Though at least it also helps the team.

I also think it may be quite a shame to waste the healing potential of Rune Focus by not combining it with a Templar heal and by only using resto skills instead. You cannot gain the great +100% heals from the passive of healing while in the aoe of Rune Focus. Though I guess you need people to remain in the aoe to heal them with that added bonus which can be tricky when everyone is kiting and running around.Anyway, seems like a strong build though. Be a real pain trying to take you out when you're heal/tanking.

Well, sounds good but I was almost certain that the description of Rune Focus reads as "gain immunity to interrupt effects" which would, in my opinion and comprehension of this description, mean that skills that "interrupt" specifically such as Hidden Blade and basic moves that interrupt (bashing with your shield) would be the only ones you would be immune to, but that hard CC skills likes stuns would still affect you while you were in the aoe of Rune Focus.Just like how interrupts will still affect you if you have Immovable active and not Rune Focus as well despite not being able to be stunned.Unless you plan to have both skills active at the same time of course

Hey, just noticed a discrepancy between these, the Aldemeri Dominion passives and the "Comprehensive document" of all the known skills.Here "Gift of Magnus" is listed as providing +10% max magicka, where as in the skill document it is listed as giving +7 in-combat magicka regen. Anyone know which is correct?

Another few random questions to anyone out here who knows the answers: 1. Anyone know the mitigation caps (in percentage) on each armour type? 2. Can you enchant any armour type with any enchantment? For example, can you enchant heavy armour with a "+ X magicka" enchantment? 3. Has anyone seen how many stats or enchantments you can have on one item? E.g. the most I've seen is two which were on a shield and were "+10% block mitigation" and "-11% reduced block cost" on the same item. 4. What types of enchantments have you seen? Are there any "+ X% stamina regeneration in combat" enchantments for example? Cheers. This is the best ESO site out there, yes in all of the internets, without a question! Keep up the fantastic work, man, and don't undervalue the great site you're running and fantastic bunch of people that you've managed to get together here for all these awesome discussions and up-to-date ESO information summaries. I've appreciated the site and the info it has given me tremendously.

Thanks so much, Irons, for the info! Really appreciate it man.

P.S. If it is not listed anywhere in the beta as a given figure per minute or second - may be time how long it takes to regen an empty bar and divide your total stamina by the time while still staying in some form of combat? Anyway, this is all assuming you get a chance to play beta at some point soon, of course, or can remember from previous sessions (I'm assuming you've played beta ). Thanks in advance again either way.

Irons, you wouldn't happen to know or be able to get to know what the base stamina regeneration amount per minute (or per second) of a character at lvl 50 is in combat (without any modifiers)?I mostly ask because I want to know if it is possible to keep Immovable active constantly which I believe would cost a character 420 stamina every 8 seconds. Even if it meant not using any blocks, dodges, heavy attacks, etc.If you know or could find out and pass the info along at any point in the future I would appreciate it immensely and you'd save me hours of "um'ing" and "ah'ing" while being indecisive about whether I should attempt to include it in my potential builds!!

Hey guys, this is a random point but when talking about Magicka and maximising magicka regen I had quite an idea for anyone wanting to play Templar but need to get this confirmed as even possible:Here it is for quick and possibly extremely reliable magicka regen:Using passive: Restoring Spirit (gain 4% magicka when activating an ability) in conjunction with spamming the Active skill: Entropy (which has no cost and instant cast with its own magicka return) could lead to really fast regeneration of your magicka.In a matter of seconds you could go from potentially no magicka back up to 2000 magicka (for example if your total magicka is that high which is likely if using a build that has armour stats and level points mostly thrown into magicka).The only things that I could see preventing this are:1. An inability to recast Entropy on the same target though I imagine all this would do is refresh the DoT duration and Magicka return HoT duration and nothing more so would be likely allowed OR 2. The skill description of Restoring Spirit fails to mention that "abilities" does not mean any ability but just the ones in the "Dawn's Wrath" skill lineJust food for thought and would like to know what you guys think of this being a possibility. And yes, I do realise you would be sacrificing a skill slot for entropy for the sake of mostly a ridiculous magicka return but I think for some builds this would be worth slotting if it does what I think it could in conjunction with that passive. So what do you all think? Could it work? Is it incorrect/impossible for certain?P.S. Loving this thread - heaps of awesome ideas to constantly read through!

Thanks for the input! I do like the idea of so much AoE especially given that we're likely to run into enemy players that are probably mostly going to be sticking together in large raids. I think you're right about needing to include way more aoe skills and I guess the splash damage on 2-handers is pretty decent for dealing out the damage.I did have one question though, I have been always assuming that we had to slot at least 2 "weapon" skills and could only have 3 of our 5 skills as "class" or "other" skills. Is this true or can we make the 5 skills up from totally class skills for example?