The Sorcerer Thread

[kylephelps757]

What do you guys think of a Heavily armored 2H sorcerer with both pets and the armor spell on one bar and a destruction/healing staff and some utility and damage spells on the other bar.

 

The idea here is that you start off in melee and the pets using the 2H and use the majority of your stamina then switch back to the staff and nuke line with a nearly fresh mana pool. What do you think?

[Musclemagic]

I wonder if there is any chance of a meele sorcerer being effective?

 

Can you have 2 or more Deadric Summonings simultaneously?

 

I thought of an Heavy Armor build, and tanking the damage while your pet(s)? deal damage from behind

 

Maybe with dual wield or 2h for more damage. But do the weapon based skills do enough damage? as you would rely only on oets and buffs from the Sorcerer tree

 

I'm guessing that a Shield would do better than 2h or DW. You won't be doing much damage anyway, so you might want to gives yourself some extra tankiness and let your pets do more work.

 

Something like this maybe:

 

7 heavy, 1h/S

Shield Charge

Low Slash

Twilight

Familiar

Conjured Ward

?

 

No problems there for a nice solo build.

[irons]

Breton Sorc

7 light

Destruction Staff

 

Mage's Fury

Crystal Shard (with chance to be an instant cast for 50% mag)

Entropy

Bound Armor (Morph increased armor)

Twillight (Morph for extra Magicka reg)

Overload (Morph restore magicka with basic attacks)

 

second bar same as first just instead of twilight Dark Exchange and for PvP Negate magic

 

The idea is quite simple a Breton Sorc has high spell resi, high magicka reg and quite a lot of cost reduce.

With this you gain an extra 20% Hp reg a big armor buff some extra passive dmg through your pet.

Entropy is a dot which also is a HoT for you.

Crystal Shard's hits really hard plus is a knockdown + heals you for 6% of your max HP.

And Fury is your spam attack.

[Musclemagic]

Breton Sorc

7 light

Destruction Staff

 

Mage's Fury

Crystal Shard (with chance to be an instant cast for 50% mag)

Entropy

Bound Armor (Morph increased armor)

Twillight (Morph for extra Magicka reg)

Overload (Morph restore magicka with basic attacks)

 

second bar same as first just instead of twilight Dark Exchange and for PvP Negate magic

 

The idea is quite simple a Breton Sorc has high spell resi, high magicka reg and quite a lot of cost reduce.

With this you gain an extra 20% Hp reg a big armor buff some extra passive dmg through your pet.

Entropy is a dot which also is a HoT for you.

Crystal Shard's hits really hard plus is a knockdown + heals you for 6% of your max HP.

And Fury is your spam attack.

 

OP, haha

[irons]

OP, haha

Actually I think I allready have a better build.

[irons]

I wasn't able to nail down all the informations I got to show of my Jekyll&Hyde build which basically is a pure Healer and a pure DPS in just 1 build.

 

But in the meantime here is a Healer build:

 

 

First of all Healing is quite cost effective in this game. Because you don't really need to spam any heal like you would spam a Dps skill.

Secondly the regeneration in this game is way lower than we expected.

At lvl 15 I had a Mag Reg of 29 it would have been 30 or 31 if it would have been softcaped. This 29 means that every 2 sec I reg 29 points of Mag at that point I had around 500 Mag and cheap spells cost around 80 mag other cost over 100.

 

The Sorc is able to manage that with skills like Overload which has a morph which restores magicka for every normal attack and Dark Exchange. And reduction of Spell costs which seem not to have a softcap.

 

 

Grand Healing

Regeneration

Blessing of Protection

Encase

Bound Armor

 

Overload

 

 

Grand Healing

Regeneration

Blessing of Protection

Annulment

Dark Exchange

 

Overload

 

 

Annulment is more powerful than it looks like because most attacks are spells. It is used to buy yourself enough time to channel Dark Exchange. Dark Exchange is more useful on a Healer than on a DPS char because your main Heal Grand Healing last for 3-4 secs which gives you enough time to cast it in between. Bound Armor gets removed when you switch your hotbar while Annulment stays active, that's the reason why Bound Armor is only on your main bar the advantage of Bound Armor is that it doesn't cost you anything to maintain it and that it adds a nice HP reg bonus.

Also with it the Armor trait which grants you +x% Spell Res and Armor becomes more effective.

Overload is on both of your bars because with it your base attack becomes actually useful and regs magicka.

I choose Encase as my fifth skill because in dungeons you often fight big groups of mobs and a AoE immobilize, which can be traited so it also deals dmg, is quite nice to have.

[Theoryexpert]

One thing about dark exchange I would like to discuss: is that stamina is extremely important in PVP but not in the way most people think. Stamina abilities typically suck compared to their magicka counterparts. The best abilities in the game tend to be class abilities, which all use magicka. So what makes stamina so important? It is your reactionary defense. Its your CC break, your dodge rolls (which might break immobilize and snare), and your blocks. Stamina is essentially your survival.

 

Here is the deal: In PVP the squishier your class is, the more dead you are when your stamina gets too low to break CC. As far as I know, there is no diminishing returns on CC in this game, if you don't have the stamina you can essentially be permanently stun locked until you regenerate enough stamina to break out.

 

A tanky class might be able to afford being CC'd for several seconds, but a squishy class can not afford to be CC'd for even a few seconds, because they will not survive it. Therefore I do not think dark exchange will be very good in PVP, you need your stamina. You also cant afford the time cost to sit there and channel it. 

[CanisPanther]

So I've been mulling over what is more important: + damage or + power? Could anyone drop some bombs on me? This is in regards to my Sorc build.Also does anyone know what the damage modifier is on Overload is? Like what kind of damage plus does it add to attacks?

[Theoryexpert]

Nobody knows if +damage or +power is better right now, except some internal game testers. Most likely they will be pretty balanced. One might be better in PVP, the other in PVE.

[irons]

Best dmg stat? That's relative easy it's crit.

[CanisPanther]

This is my Sorcerer "Shepard" Build: It's main focus is playing the back line defending healers with raw force and assisting the front line afar with our bow. We focus on pure damage relying on attacking while blocking as our only interrupt so we afford no distance between Critical Charge and Lightening Form. Anyone who presses our healers will pay dearly, especially those pesky Dual Wielders who rely on a casted Fury to do their damage as we can interrupt before we blow up on them. We pack no cast or channel time and with a high enough stamina pool, we will not be contained. We are a raging shit storm with you in our sights.Orc/Redguard 6 Medium (ST/Crit/Melee bonus) Racials, 'nuff said.The other thing is we plan on abusing the armor look change. Make all of our armor look like heavy and I think people will leave us alone. Especially if we can time Lightening Form when we're first attacked, might make people reel back and choose a "softer" target.2.5 ST 1. 5 H. 1 M (subject to change when lvl 50 costs are determined)2h- Axe (with such a high attack rate, the bleed proc might sneak up on people.) Sword (flat damage anyone?) WTF is a Mace? If they have heavy armor, you're wasting your time. 2h is good for us for Stamina bonuses.1. Surge (damage?)2. Momentum (MOAR DAMAGE!?!?)3. Critical Charge (gap close, also a good way to bounce between targets and apply pressure)4. Reverse Slash (spam with heavy attacks for sustained DPS and finisher) 5. Lightening Form w/Boundless Storm- +30% movement speed- (this is our "oh shit" button, if we're taking too much damage or if we're engaged in a skirmish where our enemy is kiting just inside charge range so we can't effectively close the gap. It's also really nice if someone gets the drop on us in our 2h set up to buffer our defense and put ourselves in a position to attack. Plus, we become like lacquer, unable to be shaken from skin.)Ultimate. Overload or Racial (depending on which does more damage) Negate Magic seems like I could really cause disarray, I just think it takes away from our bursty mindset.This is our primary bar, our dps, the reason we live and will die. We are a glass cannon in every respect and all should fear us should we become unchained while unfocused. We don't expect to live long but we will do great things to those we single out. Our Ultimate is up in the air at this juncture just depending what we can achieve endgame. Orc Racial is nice for mitigation and damage boost. With enough Stamina Regeneration, Redguard Racial would benefit us defensively for CC breaks and sprints, as well as an endless assault. Overload is dependent on A. If it splashes. B. How much damage v.s. Stamina is consumed. And it's morph would provide more Surges and Lightening Forms.Bow- this is to shoot from the back line and weaken targets before we charge and obliterate. It's also nice if we don't feel like engaging but still want to apply pressure, and it's also nice for when we're done killing an attacker in our back like and desperately need to apply pressure to save a other across the way. Anyways, ranged/melee combo is nothing new.Plus, Bow is our CC bar as well to save our healers. This bar is never meant for engaging into enemy armies.1. Snipe (long distance poke, stamina dump.)2. Poison Arrow (we like it for it's distance; any closer and we'd Critical Charge. Being able to interrupt from the healer line is great, but being able to interrupt down the healer line is even better. We will irritate the pesky melee.)3. Scatter Shot (for when we can't out damage the pressure and need to provide or make a quick escape ourselves. When our healers are too low on health and we can't destroy their assaulters fast enough, we switch to bow and pop one of these off to buy them some time.)4. Mage's Fury (the Reverse Slash of our 2nd bar. With enough mana, it shouldn't be unreasonable to pop this twice while laying down arrows looking for the finish. Plus, disintegration is total win.)5. Bolt Escape w/Streak (this is how we create distance after we kill in melee and leave a lasting impression. Blow through the front line and leave a sour taste in their mouths when you do. )Ultimate: Racials, Overload, Storm Atronach maybe if we wanted to really fuck shit up when we disengaged from melee.This is really a utility bar, so it's open to change. I didn't take Entropy because I don't care to heal myself, I'll just make exchanges with my back line; saving their lives in exchange for heals. You could also put Winged Twilight in here as well, as the mana aura would benefit everybody. It's important to note that you'll want to level a Dark Magic ability at some point for the passives. I feel with both bars I'm competent enough as a damage dealer, and should be able to jump in and out picking up kills and/or assists.Feel free to tear this apart guys, keep in mind this is a PvP pure DPS glass cannon melee/utility distance build. I don't plan to live long. I also intend to tend the heard (healers), as I am their Shepard, and none shall become estranged within my flock.

[Theoryexpert]

Cool build, seeing it is a PVP build I have some suggestions to improve it. I like most of the skills you have chosen, but I would consider having bolt escape on both bars, as I consider that to be one of the sorcerrors best pvp abilities, and you can combo it well with critical charge by charging in and out of combat. You can actually do hit and runs this way and your survival increases dramatically even without heavy armor.

 

To be completely honest though, it is too reliant on stamina, a PVP build should never use stamina heavy abilities because you need that stamina for reactive defenses (CC break, and dodge rolls), and also it looks to me like the strongest sorcerror pvp builds will have at least one summon, and seeing as you did not pick any, sorcerror may not be the best class to choose for you. The only class skills you picked are lightning form, surge, mages fury, bolt escape.

[CanisPanther]

Cool build, seeing it is a PVP build I have some suggestions to improve it. I like most of the skills you have chosen, but I would consider having bolt escape on both bars, as I consider that to be one of the sorcerrors best pvp abilities, and you can combo it well with critical charge by charging in and out of combat. You can actually do hit and runs this way and your survival increases dramatically even without heavy armor.To be completely honest though, this is not a good pvp build. It is too reliant on stamina, a PVP build should never use stamina heavy abilities because you need that stamina for reactive defenses (CC break, and dodge rolls), and also it looks to me like the strongest sorcerror pvp builds will have at least one summon, and seeing as you did not pick any, sorcerror may not be the best class to choose for you. The only class skills you picked are lightning form, surge, mages fury, bolt escape.To give you a sample of a more effective PVP hotbar for a sorcerror I'd probably do something like this if I was using a 2 hander. Use no more than 2 stamina abilitiesCritical ChargeLightning FormDaedric CurseDaedric MinesBolt EscapeThis is a much stronger PVP ability bar for many reasons. First, having one summoning ability on your bar gives you 10% better health regeneration, and the daedric mines and bolt escape give you some CC which your build is lacking (you need to have at least SOME CC in a pvp build to force the enemy to use their stamina on a CC breaker). Reverse slash is also replaced because its not good in pvp as its a melee range finisher that is quite worthless until your opponent is low health, after which it becomes a huge stamina drain.This is an extremely good hit and run class and has actually got me personally interested in sorcerror. This is how you essentially play:Charge in and then activate lightning form to be able to tank some damage and use the deadric curse, plant the daedric mines, and then quickly bolt escape out of there and switch to your ranged weapon (which I have not covered) or simply just charge back in and go to town with your 2 hander.. You get in an out of melee range quick and should take very little return damage.

As I don't know the numbers yet, I can't argue about the Stamina costs of dodge rolls and CC breaks. If its a flat % then high ST= low ST. If its a flat number, then high ST can't be a bad thing. This build isn't meant for spamming anything more than Reverse Slash when the enemies health is low. If I can't charge in with Momentum and heavy attack, Reverse Slash, break CC, Reverse Slash, then I've charged too early. I also dont see why I'd only have one ST ability on my main DPS bar? If regular and heavy attacks are that good, I should have no trouble keeping my ST high enough to use abilities as needed? I don't mean to take anyone head on, more finish low and fleeting targets. I pack a lot of ST abilities because I plan on using as much of the Redguard passives to my advantage as possible. I could see maybe replacing Surge with Curse, Mines or maybe Bolt Escape, but I should only Bolt out after a kill, I should be poking with my bow.I understand you're helping mold a PvP build for honest PvP where I could 1v1 but I was looking more on praying on the weak and swatting flies off my healers. It'll take me a couple days to mull over adding survivability, which I very well may need more of, but won't really know how effective I am or am not until playing it out on the battlefield. If I can't get the kill, Lightening Form, CC break, bow bar, Bolt Escape. If I can't get away as simple as that, I've overestimated myself and underestimated my target. As for a summon, I'd consider replacing Surge, just trying to find a place for the other abilities. I really like Momentum + Surge though. Heavy attacks do 50% more damage than standard is my understanding. So, with lvl one values of the abilities and a 10 damage weapon, it's not unrealistic to have 10% damage initially, going up 2% every 2 seconds to round out at 30% damage at 20 seconds from Momentum. And if you wait 3 seconds to pop Surge, you get +3 weapon damage, which is 30%, for 17 seconds. So you can have 42% weapon damage after 3 seconds, and your very last hit, if timed right, has the potential of 60% damage, with you breaking even after 10 seconds with heavy attacks if it's 50% of standard attacks. That's a +42% damage Critical Charge to start the fight and free heavy attacks after a few swings if it's only 50% of standard attacks.I guess you could call this a Kill Stealing or Kill Securing build. In a battle full of honest PvP builds, someone has to make a sacrifice and go for the win at all times.I don't know, I'm going to look at it all again and see if I can break away from some of the ST abilities and add a little more class skills.

[CanisPanther]

In light of recent knowledge bombs that CC breaks cost 50% of your ST pool, we've made a friendlier version of our primarily melee Sorc, enjoy. Atleast we know that ST Regen>Flat STRedguard 6/6 Medium2h1. Momentum2. Surge3. Critical Charge4. Encase w/Restraining Prison (adds snare at the end of a 4.5 immobilization, wtfpwn.)5. Lightening Form w/Boundless Storm (+30% move speed.)Ultimate: Overload or Powercharge, whichever boosts our melee the most.I love the idea of Surge/Momentum combo, heavy attacks with no cost at the speed of standard ones sounds win for melee. Encase also effects all enemies within 15mx45m so it should cause a lot of ST dumps for a group of people to get moving again. Such a devastating ability for a melee to possess.Bow (best weapon to take advantage of our crit, plus Surge/Momentum/Overload/Powercharge can transfer through bars)1. Snipe or Poison Arrow (ST dump)2. Mage's Fury3. Winged Twilight (two shots are better than one and everyone loves extra mana/Mage's Fury!)4.a Daedric Curse (good DoT, and will discourage people grouping together so we can pick up a clean, single target.)4.b Entropy (a healing DoT.)4.c Dark Exchange (if we find ourselves never in danger at range, why not create endless waves of Mage's Fury?)5. Bolt Escape (we keep it here for more damage on our main bar, plus Momentum/Surge/Lightening Form will all persist beyond bar swap.)Ultimate: Storm Atronach or Negate MagicOur only CC with our Bow is Bolt Escape because we should be firing from our back line, so if someone is pursuing us, take a step back, if they advance, 2h them.

[Prime]

Full HA DW/S&S Sorc Nord/Orc

 

Hotbar 1.DW

 

1. a. Twin Slashes b. Flurry

2. a. Flurry b. Whirlwind

3. a. Whirlwind b. Lightning Form (30% inc ms)

4. Bolt Escape

5. Unstable Familiar

Ultimate. Overload

 

Hotbar 2.S&S

 

1.  Surge

2. a. Lightning Form b. Bound Armor

3. Defensive Posture

4. Immovable

5. Unstable Familiar

Ultimate. Negate Magic

 

Full MA or 1HA 5MA DW/S&S Sorc Khajiit

 

Hotbar 1.DW

 

1. a. Twin Slashes b. Flurry

2. a. Flurry b. Whirlwind

3. a. Whirlwind b. Lightning Form (30% inc ms)

4. Bolt Escape

5. Unstable Familiar

Ultimate. Overload

 

Hotbar 2.S&S

 

1.  Surge

2. a. Lightning Form b. Bound Armor

3. Defensive Posture

4. a. Bound Armor b. Immovable

5. Unstable Familiar

Ultimate. Negate Magic

[Rally]

Full HA DW/S&S Sorc Nord/Orc

 

Hotbar 1.DW

 

1. a. Twin Slashes b. Flurry

2. a. Flurry b. Whirlwind

3. a. Whirlwind b. Lightning Form (30% inc ms)

4. Bolt Escape

5. Unstable Familiar

Ultimate. Overload

 

ur first bar doesnt make any sence:

3 stamina based attacks

u wont be able to use the mana u generate from overload.

no possibility to keep the target inplace for the whole channel of flurry.

why is surge not on ur dpsbar?

[Prime]

I obviusly put a 17 second duration long buff on the second action bar.

 

The mana from overload is just a bonus.

[Theoryexpert]

If youre going to use a 2 hander as a sorc pvp build, I really think the one thing you absolutely need to do is put bolt escape on that bar. It allows you to charge both in and out of combat, and that added mobility is priceless.

[CanisPanther]

If youre going to use a 2 hander as a sorc pvp build, I really think the one thing you absolutely need to do is put bolt escape on that bar. It allows you to charge both in and out of combat, and that added mobility is priceless.

I totally get the hit and run lifestyle for a 2h, but that just seems like it'll push us into using Critical Charge to re-engage too much, eating up our ST pool. I mean the only thing you could replace would be Encase which is a boss CC. All the other moves scream melee. I still don't think it's too much to ask to switch bars for Bolt Escape while Lightening Form is active so I could hit the ground running.

[Theoryexpert]

PVP Battlemage

 

5 Light Armor 2 Heavy Armor

17 Magicka

17 Health

16 Stamina

High Elf or Redguard

Potion: Health 

Food: Stamina

Mundus: Stamina

 

Try to balance stats to keep from getting the overcharged debuff which causes diminishing returns. Balance magicka and stamina regen, and avoid health regen since you aren't a tank.

 

2H 

 

Critical Charge 

Daedric Curse Lightning Form

Bolt Escape

Immovable

Ultimate: Overload

 

Destruction Staff

 

Crystal Shard

Daedric Curse

Entropy

Bolt Escape

Immovable

Ultimate: Highborn

 

Activate Immovable and keep it up permanently. Curse your enemy, then charge him and activate lightning form. Melee the enemy as needed, and also use bolt escape to stun and create a spell defense, then charge right back in. Switch to destruction staff as an alternate ranged weapon if needed.

[irons]

 

PVP 2 Handed DPS Sorcerror

 

Light Armor

30 Magicka

20 Health

0 Stamina

High Elf Altmer

Potion: Health

 

Destruction Staff

 

Weakness to Elements

Daedric Curse

Entropy

Bolt Escape

Annulment

Ultimate: Highborn

 

2H sword enchanted for lightning

 

Critical Charge 

Mages FuryLightning Form

Bolt Escape

Annulment

Ultimate: Overload

 

 

Open Fight with  daedric curse, entropy, annulment, then activate highborn, cast weakness to elements, and switch to 2 hander. Charge in, or bolt escape out and charge back in and activate lightning form. Finish off the enemy from here in melee range.

 

Why lightning entchantment? The passive of the Sorc does only effect your lightning spells.

[Theoryexpert]

I didnt have a reason, just enchanted for lightning, since Im already going lightning damage. 

 

Charging in, bolt escaping out, and charging right back in is going to be tons of fun! I think I found my class. Here is the updated build.

 

PVP Battlemage

 

5 Light Armor 2 Heavy Armor

25 Magicka

0 Health

25 Stamina

High Elf or Redguard

Potion: Health 

 

Try to balance stats to keep from getting the overcharged debuff which causes diminishing returns. Balance magicka and stamina regen, and avoid health regen since you aren't a tank. You have no heals or any way to recover health, so health potions are your potion of choice.

 

2H 

 

Critical Charge 

Daedric Curse Lightning Form

Bolt Escape

Immovable

Ultimate: Overload, Highborn, or Power Charge

 

2H Bar 2

 

Momentum

Surge

Lightning Form

Bolt Escape

Immovable

Ultimate: Overload, Highborn, or Power Charge

 

Activate Immovable and lightning form and keep both of them up permanently. Curse your enemy, then charge and start using your 2 handed basic attacks. Use bolt escape to stun and create a spell absorbing defense when needed, and then charge right back in. Switch to bar 2 to activate surge and momentum for longer fights, then switch back to bar 1. Use overload to recover mana.

[CanisPanther]

I didnt have a reason, just enchanted for lightning, since Im already going lightning damage. Charging in, bolt escaping out, and charging right back in is going to be tons of fun! I think I found my class. Here is the updated build.PVP Battlemage5 Light Armor 2 Heavy Armor17 Magicka17 Health16 StaminaHigh Elf or RedguardPotion: Health Food: StaminaMundus: StaminaTry to balance stats to keep from getting the overcharged debuff which causes diminishing returns. Balance magicka and stamina regen, and avoid health regen since you aren't a tank.2H Critical Charge Daedric Curse Lightning FormBolt EscapeImmovableUltimate: OverloadDestruction StaffCrystal ShardDaedric CurseEntropyBolt EscapeImmovableUltimate: HighbornActivate Immovable and keep it up permanently. Curse your enemy, then charge him and activate lightning form. Melee the enemy as needed, and also use bolt escape to stun and create a spell defense, then charge right back in. Switch to destruction staff as an alternate ranged weapon if needed.

Yeah, if I went with cloth, I could certainly see most of what you're doing here. Personal preference, I'd use Surge instead of Curse, Mage's Fury instead of Crystal Shard, and Powercharge or Storm Atronach since Highborn won't be available.

[Theoryexpert]

Daedric curse is really good damage for the magicka it seems, and its aoe. In addition, having it on your hotbar gives you +10% health regen. Overall I think its more valuable then surge, even on a melee battlemage like me. Surge is still good though and you could definitely use it instead of daedric curse. I think daedric curse would be more fun to use, because you have to recast it every 3.5 seconds, where as surge you recast ever 17 seconds, and fun factor is a factor in my builds.

 

As for mages fury, its a great spell but the problem is that it doesnt hit its potential until a target is low. In PVE its going to be great, might be great in pvp too. If it is Ill use it, its definitely a top candidate.

[CanisPanther]

Daedric curse is really good damage for the magicka it seems, and its aoe. In addition, having it on your hotbar gives you +10% health regen. Overall I think its more valuable then surge, even on a melee battlemage like me. Surge is still good though and you could definitely use it instead of daedric curse. I think daedric curse would be more fun to use, because you have to recast it every 3.5 seconds, where as surge you recast ever 17 seconds, and fun factor is a factor in my builds.As for mages fury, its a great spell but the problem is that it doesnt hit its potential until a target is low. In PVE its going to be great, might be great in pvp too. If it is Ill use it, its definitely a top candidate.

Yeah, you got me thinking for sure. Redguard 5 M 2 HSpec for spell pen if I not wearing cloth hurts that bad. Rest would be standard regen/pen/crit/etc, can't say until I actually play.2h MomentumSurgeCritical ChargeLightening FormImmovable OverloadBowBolt EscapeMage's FuryEntropyWinged TwilightImmovable Powercharge or Storm AtronachSlight alterations due to relying more on melee. Bow is for crit that I'll be stacking cause of medium armor. I out Bolt Escape on bar two, because with Immobable up at all times, shouldn't be a problem to switch bars and dip if need be. I figure with Mage's Fury, if I don't have an ult to proc Overload, I could Bolt Escape, turn, and unload arrows with Mage's Fury for a spectacular finish.