Min/Max Combos (Very Early Theorycrafting)

[Musclemagic]

Is invisibility and sneaking the same thing? I know that magelight is supposed to reveal you if you're sneaking/stealthing, but I was under the impression that invisibility was a totally different animal, one that the nightblade abilities touch on. 

 

They specifically mention sneaking characters when referring to magelight's ability. But I might just be nitpicking.

 

Anyway, thanks for the input! I think I'm going to go with Nightblade and check out some of the siphoning abilities, see if I can't make myself a loose set of skills to play with. 

 

The sneaky-heals I had in mind wasn't so much spamming heals while stealthed/invisible, but being viable enough in stealth (having a bit of medium armor for the bonuses) to sneak past enemy lines with a group of stealthies and then act as a support and heals for them. I'll see if I can do anything viable with a bow for that, but if worst comes to worst, I suppose I could use a destro staff. I just hate the aesthetics of staves- it's bad enough using one for resto!

 

My other nightblade is going to be tank/DPS, that should be fun too.

 

Yeah, stealth/invis are different. Magelight will only effect Stealth. Invis won't be gamebreaking, so don't choose a character off of that. The best use of Invisibility is to use it while stealthing on a melee character so that you can get on an enemy without breaking stealth.

 

Mark Target is an amazing spell for NB DPS and that may actually be one of the best abilities in the game. For tank build though I'd recommend not being a nightblade, there isn't enough passive damage reduction.

 

There are ways to make everything work, and gear is going to be more important for pushing you into a role than abilities anyway, so unless you're going for an extremely specific build-type then I would just play what you think will be the most fun!

[Traveler]

RedguardNightbladeHeavy ArmorI'm assuming the attributes work like skyrim (choose one to upgrade 10 points per level). Unlike skyrim, there will be a cap to each attribute (words of zenimax), and I'm making an educated guess it's 30 upgrades (300 points).Health 400 (30 upgrades, max)Stamina 275 (15 upgrades, plus 10% redguard)Magika 140 (4 upgrades )My goal is to get as much health as possible while still finding a sweet spot for............ maintaining 100% uptime on momentum, immovable, and haste. Two Handed weapon bar1 Critical Charge2 Shadow Cloak/ switch skill3 Immovable take 20% less damage, immunities to disabling effects4 Momentum 10-30% damage increase5 Haste - 30% light and heavy attack speed increaseShadow Cloak gets a spot because it will trigger stamina regain and damage reduction due to passives. It'll get switched out a lot depending on what I'm doing. I have this idea in my head. So, I'm fighting some guy in cyrodil. Then I turn invisible and charge someone else. He's like "Holy handgrenades batman, this tanky thing appeared out of no where!". And then While the first guy turns around to chase me I do it again... and again... And...I'd feel like a pinball that can only be seen when it hits the bumpers, who are actually enemies. I couldn't think of anything really great to couple bar 1 with, so I defaulted to healing. Restoration Staff bar1 entropy2 siphoning strike3 force siphon4 regeneration5 guardian circleUltimateDeath Stroke - looks like a solid burst skill. But I'm mostly interested in the 75% healing reductionI also looked at the redguard racial that grants "power". The only other mention of "power" that I know of is the siphoning ability drain power. It could be good to stack them. I don't know what power is though. Maybe it's just like attack power in wow. Can't wait till this game comes out!

[Musclemagic]

RedguardNightbladeHeavy ArmorI'm assuming the attributes work like skyrim (choose one to upgrade 10 points per level). Unlike skyrim, there will be a cap to each attribute (words of zenimax), and I'm making an educated guess it's 30 upgrades (300 points).Health 400 (30 upgrades, max)Stamina 275 (15 upgrades, plus 10% redguard)Magika 140 (4 upgrades )My goal is to get as much health as possible while still finding a sweet spot for............ maintaining 100% uptime on momentum, immovable, and haste.Two Handed weapon bar1 Critical Charge2 Shadow Cloak/ switch skill3 Immovable take 20% less damage, immunities to disabling effects4 Momentum 10-30% damage increase5 Haste - 30% light and heavy attack speed increaseShadow Cloak gets a spot because it will trigger stamina regain and damage reduction due to passives. It'll get switched out a lot depending on what I'm doing.I have this idea in my head. So, I'm fighting some guy in cyrodil. Then I turn invisible and charge someone else. He's like "Holy handgrenades batman, this tanky thing appeared out of no where!". And then While the first guy turns around to chase me I do it again... and again... And...I'd feel like a pinball that can only be seen when it hits the bumpers, who are actually enemies.I couldn't think of anything really great to couple bar 1 with, so I defaulted to healing.Restoration Staff bar1 entropy2 siphoning strike3 force siphon4 regeneration5 guardian circleUltimateDeath Stroke - looks like a solid burst skill. But I'm mostly interested in the 75% healing reductionI also looked at the redguard racial that grants "power". The only other mention of "power" that I know of is the siphoning ability drain power. It could be good to stack them. I don't know what power is though. Maybe it's just like attack power in wow.Can't wait till this game comes out!

 

It's quite a bit higher than those numbers, I think it's 20 per level + %'s/#'s from enchants and abilities(all passive, except for regeneration, it looks like.)

 

That's a solid build, it's pretty much the exact build I'd use if I use a 2H. I'd be a khajiit though to synergize with the +crit dmg even harder. (And, of course, I wouldn't take shadowcloak--but we'll have to wait and see how worthwhile it ends up being.)

 

Love it though, even if it's not going to get you a victory, that pinball thing sounds pretty epic! Haha

[irons]

It's quite a bit higher than those numbers, I think it's 20 per level + %'s/#'s from enchants and abilities(all passive, except for regeneration, it looks like.) That's a solid build, it's pretty much the exact build I'd use if I use a 2H. I'd be a khajiit though to synergize with the +crit dmg even harder. (And, of course, I wouldn't take shadowcloak--but we'll have to wait and see how worthwhile it ends up being.) Love it though, even if it's not going to get you a victory, that pinball thing sounds pretty epic! Haha

It's 10 per point at least in early levels but it might could go up. In an interview the said that you can only enchant your armor with stamina, magicka, health and ressistances.From the numbers we saw where players had over 1000 points stamina without spending any points on stamina it looks like the points we spend doesn't really matter because the stats on gear are way higher.

[Rally]

The Idea is to build a 2h "In Your Face" Marauder:Nightblade

Heavy Armor2H/S&B

High Stam/HP, low Magicka

Coreskills: Drain Power, (Cripple, Agony), Momentum, Immovable, Shield Charge, Uppercut, Crit ChargeUse Immovable to get into many enemys unhindered, then cast Drain Power->Momentum. Afterwards pick a target and Shield Charge->Cripple->switch 2H and just CC/DPSBasic Idea:All those + Powerbuffs(Drain Power, Momentum, Juggernaut, Sword Heavy Weapon) are %-based, which should make a Topgeared Player even better. I consider playing this with my guildmates, so heal and CC/support will be given.

I only picked 3-4 trees to use skills from, because I dont know how many Skillpoints are available at maxlvl. Same goes with Stamina and Magicka management.Otherwise those following skills would be optional: Haste, Power Bash, Aspect of Terror, Veiled Strike, Death Stroke

[Luke]

Templar. Heavy armour. 2H sword.

 

My idea is to create a build that supports both melee and spell attacks. I would like to solo comfortably by myself whilst being helpful in raids/ heroics.

 

Ultimate = radial sweep (low cost so hopefully will use a lot)

actives 1) sunfire

2) solar flare (to help pull targets and set up next attack)

  3) momentum (12% dmg every 2 secs)

  4) cleave (small splash dmg)

5) spear shards (aoe and 15% bonus to dmg)

 

The passives will help my playstyle: illuminate (targets affected by sun dmg deal 10% less dmg)

  piercing spear (bonus to dmg)

  balanced warrior (melee power increase)

  burning light (chance on hit to deal additional spear dmg)

 

I have chosen heavy armour because i want some survivabilty. The health regen passives are great and more pieces of heavy armour means greater melee power. I have chosen 2H sword for 5% dmg, chance to apply procs, splash dmg 25% and after killing foe you recieve stam regen. I hope this works for pve. I understand that this build wouldn't be any good in pvp because of lack of stuns and so fourth.

 

On a general note regarding ESO, do you guys think having 6 spells to use is enough? I would like to have atleast 2 more to make battles more fun.

[irons]

Templar. Heavy armour. 2H sword. My idea is to create a build that supports both melee and spell attacks. I would like to solo comfortably by myself whilst being helpful in raids/ heroics. Ultimate = radial sweep (low cost so hopefully will use a lot)actives 1) sunfire 2) solar flare (to help pull targets and set up next attact)   3) momentum (12% dmg every 2 secs)   4) cleave (small splash dmg) 5) spear shards (aoe and 15% bonus to dmg) The passives will help my playstyle: illuminate (targets affected by sun dmg deal 10% less dmg)   piercing spear (bonus to dmg)   balanced warrior (melee power increase)   burning light (chance on hit to deal additional spear dmg) I have chosen heavy armour because i want some survivabilty. The health regen passives are great and more pieces of heavy armour means greater melee power. I have chosen 2H sword for 5% dmg, chance to apply procs, splash dmg 25% and after killing foe you recieve stam regen. I hope this works for pve. I understand that this build wouldn't be any good in pvp because of lack of stuns and so fourth. On a general note regarding ESO, do you guys think having 6 spells to use is enough? I would like to have atleast 2 more to make battles more fun.

Don't forget that you have a second set of abilities which means that you basically have 12 abilities.

[Luke]

Don't forget that you have a second set of abilities which means that you basically have 12 abilities.

So if i had two 2H swords equipped i could change instantly whilst in combat to a second set of abilities? So if the battle started to turn against me i could swap to a more defensive setup? That would be great and would make it more fun.

 

Regards to my earlier post i think i would be an Altmer because i like the way the elves look and with ESO having a lot of content to explore i guess it would be important. The 3% dmg for fire would help my sun abilities and the 10% magicka i guess would mean i could spend more points into health.

[irons]

So if i had two 2H swords equipped i could change instantly whilst in combat to a second set of abilities? So if the battle started to turn against me i could swap to a more defensive setup?

Yes

[Musclemagic]

It's 10 per point at least in early levels but it might could go up. In an interview the said that you can only enchant your armor with stamina, magicka, health and ressistances.From the numbers we saw where players had over 1000 points stamina without spending any points on stamina it looks like the points we spend doesn't really matter because the stats on gear are way higher.

It must go up then, that's good to know-- first levels won't hurt your balance that much if you decide to change at like lvl 10 you'll still get a lot of stats to distribute.

 

Is that only what you can enchant with enchanting? They said there are a ton of weapon/armor enchantments that come on them.. I think I heard that there are more than in Skyrim.. but this was a while ago so they probably changed it? Do you have a link to the interview?

 

 

Don't forget that you have a second set of abilities which means that you basically have 12 abilities.

 

The Ultimate doesn't switch when you swap bars, does it? (from vids I've seen it doesn't appear to)

[irons]

The ultimate also changes. I guess the guy at quakecom which was a mid lvl char had only 1 ultimate unlocked.That's from the interview:Q: What stats will be available on armor? Because on ESO games you have just armor, and enchantments. Is there, like in traditional MMO, that you have plus intelligence, plus stats. (question submitted by reddit user DoopSlayer)A: We have enhancements for Health, Magicka and Stamina, which are your three major attributes. We have all resistance types as well, we have things on weapons, such as Heartening, which gives you shields, we have Enrages, which can give you more power, we have things that will take away power, we have life steal. Things like that.I hope that there will be more entchantments but we will have to see.http://teso.mmorpg-life.com/eso-interview-with-maria-aliprando/

[irons]

Role: Tank/Dps

Class: Dragonknight

Race: Redguard

Weaponsets: TwoHanded + Sword/shield

PvE/PvP: PvP

 

Build: Critical Charge, Momentum,  Immovable, Inhale, Inferno; Magma Armor

  Fiery Reach, Dark Talons, Dragon Blood, Obsidian Shield, Ash Field; Dragonkight Standard

 

Playstyle: The first skill set is the main dmg setup. The second one is your more defensive setup where you pull people into your zone and control them. (With Fiery Reach you can even pull people down from keep walls.)

 

Stats:

HP: 2

St: 1

Ma: 1

 

This build has a fair balance between stamina and magicka, the passivs from the regard (more stamina, higher regeneration, stamina gain when dealing dmg) and the passiv from the TwoHanded (gain stamina reg boost on kill) will help you to keep your stamina up and ones you start running out of stamina you can just which to your magicka abilities or the other way around.

 

This build will be good in 1vs1 too it's ability to sustain high amounts of dmg and very strong in big group battles because of it's areal control abilities.

With some minor changes you can easily adept it to PvE.

[Rally]

Role: Tank/Dps

Class: Dragonknight

Race: Redguard

Weaponsets: TwoHanded + Sword/shield

PvE/PvP: PvP

 

Build: Critical Charge, Momentum,  Immovable, Inhale, Inferno; Magma Armor

  Fiery Reach, Dark Talons, Dragon Blood, Obsidian Shield, Ash Field; Dragonkight Standard

 

Playstyle: The first skill set is the main dmg setup. The second one is your more defensive setup where you pull people into your zone and control them. (With Fiery Reach you can even pull people down from keep walls.)

 

Stats:

HP: 2

St: 1

Ma: 1

 

This build has a fair balance between stamina and magicka, the passivs from the regard (more stamina, higher regeneration, stamina gain when dealing dmg) and the passiv from the TwoHanded (gain stamina reg boost on kill) will help you to keep your stamina up and ones you start running out of stamina you can just which to your magicka abilities or the other way around.

 

This build will be good in 1vs1 too it's ability to sustain high amounts of dmg and very strong in big group battles because of it's areal control abilities.

With some minor changes you can easily adept it to PvE.

I somehow have a problem with builds, that use skills from many trees to funktion well.

[*]You dont know how many skillpoint you have to waste, in order to get certain desired skills.

[*]If you have to waste many skillpoints, other skills will be less powerfull.

[*]Only positive aspekt could be the usefull passives of other trees.

And you have not much incase u run out of stam/magicka. Killing/Hitting enemys is not always a given. If u run out of Magicka then u have to wait a realy long time, if u look how much the Magicka cost for some Sorcspells increase at lvl 50.

In the worstcase scenario, u wouldn't be able to use all ur Magickaskills with ur current Magickapool.

If you could just "spam" abilitys, I would run around having Immovable up all the time. And I doubt that's even close to possible!

Just some thougts, but i could be wrong thou.

[irons]

I somehow have a problem with builds, that use skills from many trees to funktion well.

[*]You dont know how many skillpoint you have to waste, in order to get certain desired skills.

[*]If you have to waste many skillpoints, other skills will be less powerfull.

[*]Only positive aspekt could be the usefull passives of other trees.

And you have not much incase u run out of stam/magicka. Killing/Hitting enemys is not always a given. If u run out of Magicka then u have to wait a realy long time, if u look how much the Magicka cost for some Sorcspells increase at lvl 50.

In the worstcase scenario, u wouldn't be able to use all ur Magickaskills with ur current Magickapool.

If you could just "spam" abilitys, I would run around having Immovable up all the time. And I doubt that's even close to possible!

Just some thougts, but i could be wrong thou.

You don't have to waste any skill points you only have to spend 1 skill point for your class trees in order to lvl other than that you just spend your skill points on the skills and passivs you want. Besides there will be enough points to skill out all abilities.

The last point has nothing to do with my build it would be a general problem.

Spamming abilities won't be a real option for any class/build you will have to use your abilities thought fully.

If you run out of stamina you will still be able to use basic attacks.

I don't expect that you will be able to keep unmoveable running at all time.

If I would run into a fight a would cast obsidian shield on myself use momentum to increase my dmg use inferno from time to time and use unmoveable when someone starts using a lot of knockbacks on me.

[Rally]

So i can skill ability/passiv A before i have to unlock ability/passiv B and vice versa?I am pretty sure u wont be able to spam that much Magicka skills with only 1/4th of ur points going into magicka.Reason: The lvl 50 char with no points in Stam had about 1.1k stam. that would be one use of caltrops/rapid maneuver. i guess its safe to say it wont be any different for Magicka. With 1/4 spent into Magicka you will still have some pool to use skills from, but u will certainly not be able to use skills whenever u feel like it. i think u will be using full heavy armor with maybe some cloth here and there.Some skills are just too powerfull with no cd on them. so there must be a restriction on the amount u can use them. Hence lots of stam/mag costs with a pretty low pool and low regen.

[irons]

So i can skill ability/passiv A before i have to unlock ability/passiv B and vice versa?

Yes, at least that's the current state.

 

I actually will use heavy armor only.

The stats I wrote down is just how my priority looks like. I will try to get enough Stamina/Magicka so that I can fight effecive and the rest goes into HP.

 

We don't know how much Stamina/Health/Magicka a lvl 50 with max gear will have and how the high the costs are for the different skills. But I'm sure Zenimax will design it so you can't spam your abilities without thinking but that you will have enough points to keep fighting smooth and fun.

[Soaks]

I would like to go with a pure stamina/hp build for my DK tank, but it seems a poor choice when comparing the skills available in the DK trees to those of the sword/board tree

 

Mainly because the sword/board tree lack AoE abilities, making me think it would suck when clearing trash (and the Fighters Guild skills just seem bad)

But perhaps the leveled/evolved skills could make it worth it?

 

Making a pure stamina/hp or pure magicka/hp tank, sadly, seems doomed to fail.

Like irons says, we will probably have to spread the points to make an effective tank build as DK.

[irons]

I would like to go with a pure stamina/hp build for my DK tank, but it seems a poor choice when comparing the skills available in the DK trees to those of the sword/board tree Mainly because the sword/board tree lack AoE abilities, making me think it would suck when clearing trash (and the Fighters Guild skills just seem bad)But perhaps the leveled/evolved skills could make it worth it? Making a pure stamina/hp or pure magicka/hp tank, sadly, seems doomed to fail.Like irons says, we will probably have to spread the points to make an effective tank build as DK.

First I wanted to make a HP/Magicka build but it seems to be more effective to have a balance between Stamina and MagickaThat way you can use the full amount of your ressources.

[Musclemagic]

The strategy of this game will hopefully come from when we use our abilities, more than what abilities we have active. I think passives will be huge, keeping out Magelight/Summons/etc. while keeping maybe ONE offensive ability and ONE defensive ability might turn out to be the very best option in almost all situations.

 

This would be due to the lack of being able to use abilities as frequently as desired.. The reason why I hope that it's like this is simply because without any cooldowns it would cause huge imbalances. Of course they need to scale things perfectly or else the difference will still be huge.

 

Yes, certain abilities like Dragon Blood will cost a huge amount of our resources.. but I think it will play similarly (even at endgame) to that of the gameplay videos-- About one activated ability every 2-4 seconds seems right.

[Musclemagic]

I would like to go with a pure stamina/hp build for my DK tank, but it seems a poor choice when comparing the skills available in the DK trees to those of the sword/board tree

 

Mainly because the sword/board tree lack AoE abilities, making me think it would suck when clearing trash (and the Fighters Guild skills just seem bad)

But perhaps the leveled/evolved skills could make it worth it?

 

Making a pure stamina/hp or pure magicka/hp tank, sadly, seems doomed to fail.

Like irons says, we will probably have to spread the points to make an effective tank build as DK.

 

 

First I wanted to make a HP/Magicka build but it seems to be more effective to have a balance between Stamina and MagickaThat way you can use the full amount of your ressources.

 

Even as a full HP/Magicka build, you'll want some stamina for heavy attacks and sprinting/dodge-rolling (esp. if you're not in light armor).

 

Even as full HP/Stam you'll need MP for some abilities, no matter how badly you want to avoid it..you're doing a huge disservice to yourself if you don't take some MP.

 

I am trying to go 100% HP/Magicka on nearly a 1hp:2mp ratio. But, I believe that I'll absolutely require a bit of additional stam to not be gimped on the battlefield.

[Rally]

Making a pure stamina/hp or pure magicka/hp tank, sadly, seems doomed to fail.

Like irons says, we will probably have to spread the points to make an effective tank build as DK.

If u went high magicka/decent stam, you should be able to have some stam management with the use of "Helping Hands".Overall i think the Earthen Heart passivs make a good stam and magicka build. Depends on "Deep Breaths" thou.

[Musclemagic]

Being more into either stamina or magicka, and not mixed in between (as much as possible) will be best.

 

It wouldn't be, if the only stats were +X Magicka, +X Stamina, or +X Health... But it looks like a lot of the time it's going to be +X% of stam, mp, or hp.

 

If you think about synergies at all, this is the most important thing. +20% of 150 is more than +10% of 125 and +10% of 125.. You get a lot more out of your stat buffs if you're a purebread. Even in this low of an example it's still almost 17% more effective (+30 stats rather than +25 from the %'s).

 

If I was going 2h or 1h/shield DK (especially with Heavy) then I'd definitely go as minimally into Magicka as possible... Especially if you plan on having a pocket healer friend with you, rather than relying on your DK tanking as much..

 

It really does depend entirely on your build. I'd like to make a 100% stamina build as my next toon (in a long long time...after my 100% magicka!) Being as pure as possible is best, by a long shot...

[Soaks]

Being more into either stamina or magicka, and not mixed in between (as much as possible) will be best.

 

It wouldn't be, if the only stats were +X Magicka, +X Stamina, or +X Health... But it looks like a lot of the time it's going to be +X% of stam, mp, or hp.

 

If you think about synergies at all, this is the most important thing. +20% of 150 is more than +10% of 125 and +10% of 125.. You get a lot more out of your stat buffs if you're a purebread. Even in this low of an example it's still almost 17% more effective (+30 stats rather than +25 from the %'s).

 

If I was going 2h or 1h/shield DK (especially with Heavy) then I'd definitely go as minimally into Magicka as possible... Especially if you plan on having a pocket healer friend with you, rather than relying on your DK tanking as much..

 

It really does depend entirely on your build. I'd like to make a 100% stamina build as my next toon (in a long long time...after my 100% magicka!) Being as pure as possible is best, by a long shot...

 

Ye, this was kind of my thinking as well. Math isn't my strong suit, but I'll trust that most of those scary numbers you hurled at me supported your conclusion

 

I hope that some of those stamina consuming skills, when leveled, will allow for more than single target tanking.

 

Big ups to you for keeping this thread alive. I've learned a lot from reading it.

[irons]

If you have 1 major ressource you get more out of a +10% bonus or a higher reg boost.However we have seen that a lvl 50 char will have around 1000 points each as a base. It would be a waste of ressources if you wouldn't use those points. Therefore everyone should have at least a few skills which Stamina/Magicka.So the most effective builds will be those which focus on 1 ressource but use both ressources.

[Soaks]

If you have 1 major ressource you get more out of a +10% bonus or a higher reg boost.However we have seen that a lvl 50 char will have around 1000 points each as a base. It would be a waste of ressources if you wouldn't use those points. Therefore everyone should have at least a few skills which Stamina/Magicka.So the most effective builds will be those which focus on 1 ressource but use both ressources.

Ye, running around with that much unused magicka seems foolish. So perhaps something like 4/5 of my skills should be stamina consuming.

And the magicka skill should preferably be a resource dump. I guess most skills in this game could be used as dumps, but there are some less situational than others. I'll have to think about this some more.